Use Trams On Great Western Way

[Alex]

Yes this needs highlighting, how would one go about involving the current administration?

[dippyhippy]

Afternoon Amanda!

 

An organised meeting is a great idea. The Kindle Centre would make an excellent venue.

 

I'm sure that with all the different aspects, SLR, Tram Plan, (possible)Eastern Crossing alternative, it would be well attended by interested parties.

[Maggie May]

I think this organised meeting would be a really good idea. Surely as well as trams the "Switch the lights" off campaign could be highlighted as this has got to cost loads less than all the new roads in Hereford! Why cant this be tried if just for a couple of months?!!

[dippyhippy]

"The Great Tram Plan", as I like to refer to it, features in an online HT story today.

 

Don't get too excited though folks, it's been deemed 'not efficient or sustainable' by the esteemed Cllr 'I don't give a sh#t ' Price.

 

Cllr Bowen had asked in a formal, written question, if 'full and proper consideration had been given' to this idea, which he said 'had very large potential benefits'.

 

Price though, had other ideas....

 

(Hereford Voice forum and members were also mentioned in the article.)

 

Apologies as usual, for not being able to provide a handy link!

[Denise Lloyd]

 

 

Herewith article  we are ruled by these 6 or 7 people with a rod of iron whether the people of Herefordshire agree with the decisions or not

 

Tramway system for Hereford ruled out

 

 

Jessica Phillips / 5 hours ago / News

 

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HOPES for a second transport system to link the north and south side of Hereford have been ruled out.

Mooted proposals for a light tramway system to run along the city's Great Western Way are ‘not viable’ according to Herefordshire Council.

Councillor Sebastian Bowen asked in a formal written question ahead of last week’s full council meeting whether full and proper consideration had been given to the possible implementation and 'very large potential benefits' of a Hereford light tramway system.

 

But responding to the question, Cllr Philip Price, cabinet member for infrastructure, said: "Detailed studies have previously been carried out to assess the costs and benefits of the introduction of such a scheme in Hereford.

"Taking into account the constraints you would expect to be associated with delivering such a scheme in a historic city centre, the studies concluded that investment would represent poor value for money when compared to other investment in transport for the city.

"Although these studies were undertaken some years ago, nothing has happened in the intervening time to suggest a new study would produce a different result."

One suggestion put forward previously by members of online forum Hereford Voice was for the tramway to run along the route of the Great Western Way, allowing room for pedestrians and cyclists.

 

Such a scheme would not cause too much disruption and would be at a fraction of the cost of putting in a road without using prime agricultural land, it was suggested.

Speaking at last week's meeting, Cllr Bowen said he felt more could be done to look at transport in a ‘radical way’.

But Cllr Price said a tramway system was not an ‘efficient’ or ‘sustainable’ solution and that the council would not be looking at introducing such a scheme any time soon.

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It will be a blow to anyone living south of the city, with proposals for a second rail link at Rotherwas also having been ruled out earlier last year.

The decision, signed off at cabinet level, said no further work would be undertaken to progress the scheme for a new link between the city’s railway station and the Rotherwas Industrial Estate because it did not offer value for money.

[Colin James]

 

 

 

Herewith article  we are ruled by these 6 or 7 people with a rod of iron whether the people of Herefordshire agree with the decisions or not

 

Tramway system for Hereford ruled out

 

 

Jessica Phillips / 5 hours ago / News

 

Share

  

 2 comments

 

 

 

HOPES for a second transport system to link the north and south side of Hereford have been ruled out.

Mooted proposals for a light tramway system to run along the city's Great Western Way are ‘not viable’ according to Herefordshire Council.

Councillor Sebastian Bowen asked in a formal written question ahead of last week’s full council meeting whether full and proper consideration had been given to the possible implementation and 'very large potential benefits' of a Hereford light tramway system.

 

But responding to the question, Cllr Philip Price, cabinet member for infrastructure, said: "Detailed studies have previously been carried out to assess the costs and benefits of the introduction of such a scheme in Hereford.

"Taking into account the constraints you would expect to be associated with delivering such a scheme in a historic city centre, the studies concluded that investment would represent poor value for money when compared to other investment in transport for the city.

"Although these studies were undertaken some years ago, nothing has happened in the intervening time to suggest a new study would produce a different result."

One suggestion put forward previously by members of online forum Hereford Voice was for the tramway to run along the route of the Great Western Way, allowing room for pedestrians and cyclists.

 

Such a scheme would not cause too much disruption and would be at a fraction of the cost of putting in a road without using prime agricultural land, it was suggested.

Speaking at last week's meeting, Cllr Bowen said he felt more could be done to look at transport in a ‘radical way’.

But Cllr Price said a tramway system was not an ‘efficient’ or ‘sustainable’ solution and that the council would not be looking at introducing such a scheme any time soon.

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It will be a blow to anyone living south of the city, with proposals for a second rail link at Rotherwas also having been ruled out earlier last year.

The decision, signed off at cabinet level, said no further work would be undertaken to progress the scheme for a new link between the city’s railway station and the Rotherwas Industrial Estate because it did not offer value for money.

 

 

 

 

We don't give up that easily but again Cllr Price dismissing another good idea, perhaps because it was our idea and not his...

 

Maybe the Council should have a read of this article which completely contradics everything said by Cllr Price.

 

 

But today the new service - described as "an efficient and sustainable" addition to Edinburgh's transport options - was fully launched and opened to the public.

[twowheelsgood]

"The Great Tram Plan", as I like to refer to it, features in an online HT story today.

 

Don't get too excited though folks, it's been deemed 'not efficient or sustainable' by the esteemed Cllr 'I don't give a sh#t ' Price.

 

Cllr Bowen had asked in a formal, written question, if 'full and proper consideration had been given' to this idea, which he said 'had very large potential benefits'.

 

Price though, had other ideas....

 

(Hereford Voice forum and members were also mentioned in the article.)

 

Apologies as usual, for not being able to provide a handy link!

 

It's only as expected - it simply doesn't fit the road building agenda of this council, who have hungry, party funding contractors to look after. As a cyclist, tram lines are an issue and have caused a deal of problems in Edinburgh. I think it should be made even simpler - why not run an electric shuttle bus backwards and forwards - no infrastructure needed.

 

Simple low cost things can make a huge difference - turning off traffic lights for example - but again, it doesn't suit a road building agenda.

[dippyhippy]

Brilliant, Two Wheels!

 

I like it. I like it very much!

 

As a 'Plan B' it has much to offer....

 

But..... will Cllr. Price...?

 

I doubt it. I doubt it very much...

[Glenda Powell]

I had the misfortune of having to listen to Cllr Price for 5 years, and he never agreed to anything that the opposition said, and when he became cabinet member it simply went to his head I am afraid if it isn't a Tory suggestion or his he doesn't want to know, and in my opinion he never will. He is the most miserable member of the council and if he ever attempted a smile I'm sure his face would crack!

[Ubique]

Twowheelgood suggestion is so easy to implement, however as the Cabinet didn't think of it ,carried out expensive Consulation ,Visited Cities over the world it's not going to happen.

[H.Wilson]

I think there could be other alternative suggestions and all would be okay too but this topic is about Trams and I would continue to press for there use along the GWW.

[Adrian Pitt]

A tram along the GWW would be ideal and most local people agree, a proper study should be done, (not work of old studies from years ago) which would also involve a tram company for their input and advice. I am sure local companies would sponsor carriages with advertising to create revenue and help fund the scheme.

[lpusseycat]

The trouble with cllr Price is he is educated beyond his intelligence come to think of it so is the rest of the tories this is a one road in one road out city that has cost this city a lot of jobs because of the infrastructure i know my husband worked for one of the larger employers at rotherwas Rexam/R.P.C  they left the city because of the infrastructure as did Thorns. That is why i cannot stand people like Cllr Price joining the rest of them for the quick backhander from developers building houses it has been going on for years and still continues to this day the Vortex land was given away to developers for nothing ask the question why and who stood to gain.

[Chris Chappell]

Think about it. Who Is going to use it? Residents of Newton Farm, Red Hill, and Hunderton. Where they going, into town! Who is coming back on tram? Same residents. There is no LA of a similar size, or under a million residents, who run their own tram/ bus service. If we charge £5.00 a ticket one way, it may earn £500 pw.

 

Can you imagine the carnage as the tram crosses the two bridges and collides with cyclists, dogs, oh and humans. If there is an entrepreneur out there who thinks he can make a profit from running a tram, laying the lines, paying for the trams to be built and extending the line around the city then they should come forward. Was that a police car I saw racing along GWW after a druggie? Hope they miss a collision with theHuman/dog/ tram!

 

 

So posters, let us set up a cooperative and put this into action. Get a business plan together and present it to council. We can find the money, alter the street scene to accommodate the tram lines. The cyclists will not mind being pushed aside by another motorised vehicle! The elderly and blind have problems with the street scene in Widemarsh Street so a tram line should be a doddle for them!

Stand well back as the external auditors blast Herefordshire Council out of the universe how wasting public money.

 

In an ideal world...........

[dippyhippy]

I'd call Albert Heijn an incredible entrepreneur.

 

He thought this idea had huge potential.

 

It was Herefordshire Council who didn't have the vision or the foresight.

[Chris Chappell]

You knew Albert of course ? Albert invented the bar code! His brother was killed by diamond smugglers . An interesting man, with many ideas, some good some bad.

 

But even his time in his wheelchair, or out at his home in North Herefordshire, he did not seriously believe that he could make a profit from a tram way nor did he come up with a business plan for it.

His support for the privatisation of the river cost you, the rate payer, a £m in High Court fees. But hey, we all make mistakes. As a result, Hereford became the laughing stock of the towns on the river Wye, and the High Court QCs walked away with loads of your money. Ask the Hereford Fishing Association.

 

Dr Heign and his Company Secretary are both dead now, but their memory lives on in the Left Bank and Kate's Yard, but please do not associate these two things with his futile ideas for a tram line.

[dippyhippy]

You say futile. I say future.

 

Let's have a bit of joined up thinking on solving Hereford's traffic issues. This could work, and make a real impact on congestion. But there has to be a willingness to at least try to find alternatives.

 

(By the way, I think you'd be quite astonished at who I've got to know over the years...eclectic doesn't even begin to cover it!)

[ragwert]

You say futile. I say future.

 

Let's have a bit of joined up thinking on solving Hereford's traffic issues. This could work, and make a real impact on congestion. But there has to be a willingness to at least try to find alternatives.

 

(By the way, I think you'd be quite astonished at who I've got to know over the years...eclectic doesn't even begin to cover it!)

Congestion...I see it & in it every day of the week.Main culprits,traffic lights.

I'd like to see all that 27 million used in the City.Removal of all traffic lights,installation of more roundabouts and a 20mph max speed enforced by speed cameras.

[dippyhippy]

That would be a start, Ragwert, and if I held the purse strings, that 27 million for the link road would have been ear marked for much better alternative projects!

[ragwert]

That would be a start, Ragwert, and if I held the purse strings, that 27 million for the link road would have been ear marked for much better alternative projects!

Making cycling from parts of the City better like from Belmont/Ross Road over new bridge and on to Edgar Street etc would be good.

I get more frustrated every time I see people not using cycleways,and this seems to me to be around 90% + of cyclists.

Watching in utter disbelief today by B&Q with a dad on his bike with toddler in back seat with young girl riding behind dodging the traffic.

Took my bike out of shed for first time this year,flat front tyre and stiff brakes....Again.Time for shiny new bike me thinks.

[Colin James]

Think about it. Who Is going to use it? Residents of Newton Farm, Red Hill, and Hunderton. Where they going, into town! Who is coming back on tram? Same residents. There is no LA of a similar size, or under a million residents, who run their own tram/ bus service. If we charge £5.00 a ticket one way, it may earn £500 pw.

 

Can you imagine the carnage as the tram crosses the two bridges and collides with cyclists, dogs, oh and humans. If there is an entrepreneur out there who thinks he can make a profit from running a tram, laying the lines, paying for the trams to be built and extending the line around the city then they should come forward. Was that a police car I saw racing along GWW after a druggie? Hope they miss a collision with theHuman/dog/ tram!

 

 

So posters, let us set up a cooperative and put this into action. Get a business plan together and present it to council. We can find the money, alter the street scene to accommodate the tram lines. The cyclists will not mind being pushed aside by another motorised vehicle! The elderly and blind have problems with the street scene in Widemarsh Street so a tram line should be a doddle for them!

Stand well back as the external auditors blast Herefordshire Council out of the universe how wasting public money.

 

In an ideal world...........

 

Can you imagine the carnage as the tram crosses the two bridges and collides with cyclists, dogs, oh and humans 

 

​Trams works in cities and locations alongside cyclists and pedestrians and much busier locations than the GWW without any problems, so I do not foresee any here either. Please take a moment to read through all of the pages on this topic.

 

This is not all about making money (which is all local councils appear to want to do) it is about providing a service to local people while reducing the massive congestion problem that exists in Hereford. This service would service Redhill - Newton Farm - Hunderton - Greyfriars -Broomy Hill - Barton - Whitecross - Edgar Street as it would pass through all of these locations and end at the railway station, if extended it could re-open the original service which used to run along the back of Holmer Rd to the top of Roman Road and coming the other way it could link up with Rotherwas at the Enterprise Zone, you are being quite blinkered reading your your response. I have a much bigger vision perhaps?

 

This is not a train! It would be a simple eco friendly light weight tram system, which could possibly be privately funded or sponsored by local business's with advertising warps on the carriages. 

 

You are either behind the idea or your not and if you are behind it, maybe it would help if you looked at the positives of a tram system rather than the all too easy negatives. 

[K.Butt]

I see that the HT are running a poll:

 

 

Your vote

 

Mooted proposals for a light tramway system to run along Hereford's Great Western Way have been ruled out by Herefordshire Council. Do you agree with this decision? Your vote  

 

Mooted proposals for a light tramway system to run along Hereford's Great Western Way have been ruled out by Herefordshire Council. Do you agree with this decision?  

• Yes – it would cost too much and is not a viable transport solution
  41%

   
• No – it would be a good, cost-effective way to link both sides of the city
  55%

   
• I don’t know.
  4%

   

[herefordman75]

It wouldn't even need to be a full on tram system (with tracks etc) what about some compact electric buses? Inductive charging at each stop, simple one at a time system on the Hunderton bridge, and a turning point at each end. As long as the driver is competent, and watches carefully, then mingling with pedestrians should be no issues at all - they do wander around town with big industrial vacuum cleaners (pedestrian controlled ones) and never seem to manage to damage any pedestrians.

 

I am thinking along the lines of the little electric trains that you see at the seaside - slightly bigger with enclosed carriages, have solar panels on the roof to aid charging, regenerative braking etc - they would be sustainable, require little or no changes to infrastructure and could be paid for with an oyster card type system.

[twowheelsgood]

It wouldn't even need to be a full on tram system (with tracks etc) what about some compact electric buses? Inductive charging at each stop, simple one at a time system on the Hunderton bridge, and a turning point at each end. As long as the driver is competent, and watches carefully, then mingling with pedestrians should be no issues at all - they do wander around town with big industrial vacuum cleaners (pedestrian controlled ones) and never seem to manage to damage any pedestrians.

 

I am thinking along the lines of the little electric trains that you see at the seaside - slightly bigger with enclosed carriages, have solar panels on the roof to aid charging, regenerative braking etc - they would be sustainable, require little or no changes to infrastructure and could be paid for with an oyster card type system.

 

Those were my thoughts, as I posted earlier, but lost interest once Cllr Chappell chimed in with his ridiculous claims of carnage. Prime example of why nothing ever happens here. I still think electric (seaside) buses are a better solution than trams, but hey ho, and why does it need to make a profit?

[DILLIGAF]

Having been to Switzerland a few times. The first thing I learnt was, watch out for the trams; they have right of way over everything! All the lights work in sequence too and having been there as non tram educated, I learnt within the hour! They don't go sucking you in like trains either. Bikes and buggies cross their paths frequently. But then again Switzerland is a country that is years ahead of the game with sensible ideas, listens to its citizens and thrives with tourism. Wonder why?

I missed 4 trams and 6 trains; I only arrived a minute late!!

 

I also agree, a tram along GWW etc does not necessarily have to uses rails, why not use a 'seaside train/tram'? Self sufficient, eco friendly, quiet, safe, revenue generator WMP could even use it as a patrol vehicle and I'm sure councillors could put in some travel expenses too, even if they don't use it!! Win win. Or am I just talking sense?

[dippyhippy]

You most definitely ARE talking sense Diligaf!

 

Just like most of the contributors to this lengthy thread.....!

 

All we need to do now is..... convince a few others!

 

Easy peasy, lemon squeezy ......not!

[H.Wilson]

Having been to Switzerland a few times. The first thing I learnt was, watch out for the trams; they have right of way over everything! All the lights work in sequence too and having been there as non tram educated, I learnt within the hour! They don't go sucking you in like trains either. Bikes and buggies cross their paths frequently. But then again Switzerland is a country that is years ahead of the game with sensible ideas, listens to its citizens and thrives with tourism. Wonder why?

I missed 4 trams and 6 trains; I only arrived a minute late!!

 

I also agree, a tram along GWW etc does not necessarily have to uses rails, why not use a 'seaside train/tram'? Self sufficient, eco friendly, quiet, safe, revenue generator WMP could even use it as a patrol vehicle and I'm sure councillors could put in some travel expenses too, even if they don't use it!! Win win. Or am I just talking sense?

 

 

I hope that you don't mean one of these lol;

 

[DILLIGAF]

I hope that you don't mean one of these lol;

 

Train-330.jpg

No more of a burnt out, boarded up shell! ;) it would then fit right in!

[dippyhippy]

Speaking for myself, I'd be quite happy with that offering, H!

 

I think it could jazz up The Lines no end!

[Adrian Pitt]

I hope that you don't mean one of these lol;

 

Train-330.jpg

 

Surely not ha ha, I cannot imagine anyone using these to go into town or work, it needs to be a proper tram, does not need to be huge but it would need to accommodate wheelchairs and possibly buggies. 

 

This type could work