Jimbo Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 Should members of the freedom church be able to run for the position of ward councillor without telling everyone they are a member of this church?
dippyhippy Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 Hi Jimbo, I'm pleased you've raised this topic, as Freedom Church does concern me. There has been much negative publicity surrounding this organisation, and I honestly feel that this is information which should be disclosed. There is a Freedom Church thread, located in the Open Forum, should anyone care to have a read through. There is also a distinction to be made perhaps, between those who choose to worship there, and those who have been in the employ....???
dippyhippy Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 I've bumped the Freedom Church thread back to the front page... so folks don't have to go rummaging for it!
Jimbo Posted April 21, 2015 Author Report Posted April 21, 2015 Hi Dippy, I'm in agreement this information should be disclosed by the candidates ( I beleive there is more than 1).
Roger Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 To qualify to be a Councillor you have me meet certain criteria like being 18, being a British/EU/Commonwealth Citizen. Also resident in the Community. Disqualifications are working for the Council/bankruptcy/recent imprisonment for more than three months. So any Church element is not covered in the rules. For any type of Religious organisation. Neither with regards to praying/working there. The question within the current rules' could be 'should candidates disclose certain facts if they are running.' As a sort of moral duty. Or as to be transparent. Some electors similarly might prefer to know if any of their candidates was a Freemason ...
Denise Lloyd Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 And there's just a few Freemasons running around as well
Denise Lloyd Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 I don't think it is so much that Freedom Church are a religion it is more a case of the morals of this particular religion.
dippyhippy Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 If somebody described themselves as being an "Extension Director at Freedom Church," what precisely, does this entail??? If this is a paid role, then it most definitely should be highlighted to prospective voters.
Jimbo Posted April 21, 2015 Author Report Posted April 21, 2015 I agree Denise, my question here is shouldn't the public know if one of their candidates are a member, when you consider the questionable ethics (if that's the right word) this lot have shown.
Cambo Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 Should members of the freedom church be able to run for the position of ward councillor without telling everyone they are a member of this church? Personally I'm suspicious when this particular church takes steps to have a former trustee run as a councillor & not declare a link as it makes me think, do they have some other motive? especially when they have had dubious funding from HC in the past? If they did get someone elected then that person would be in a good position to speak favourably for them & possible help in getting them funding for various projects?
Roger Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 I agree Denise, my question here is shouldn't the public know if one of their candidates are a member, when you consider the questionable ethics (if that's the right word) this lot have shown. I think there is also a duty on the elector to find out at least the bare minimum facts about the candidates (Local or National) in their area. Not overly applicable to Brian Wilcox and Jesse Norman (track record) in my area but there are some new faces in a newly shaped local ward where I'm sat and I will be scrutinising who they are! And what they stand for!
Ubique Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 I can fully understand concerns about this " Chuch " but just wonder where the line should be drawn - all religions are responsible for so many problems / atrocities in this World ..........?
Jimbo Posted April 21, 2015 Author Report Posted April 21, 2015 I think Cambo they have a few people in a few places and are just trying to add a few more. Perhaps all the Torys are from the freedom church lol.
dippyhippy Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 You may be closer to the mark than you think Jim!
Jimbo Posted April 21, 2015 Author Report Posted April 21, 2015 Ban religion ubique, that's the answer.
Jimbo Posted April 21, 2015 Author Report Posted April 21, 2015 I know of 2 dippy, do you know of more?
dippyhippy Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 Why would you hide it, if you didn't think it an issue?? Why would anyone avoid answering a direct question, if there wasn't a problem?? PM me Jim, we could exchange notes!
WirralPC Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 On Wirral, we have a Labour Councillor who's a member of the Mormon Church, Salt Lake City, Utah. As a condition of membership, a portion of salary (can't remember how much, but might be 10 per cent) has to be paid across to the church. I'm not sure that this drain on public money is declared to his electorate when he's out leafleting around this time, but I doubt it very much ! After all, who'd vote for that?
twowheelsgood Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 Mr Seb is suddenly noticeable by his absence.
Roger Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 On Wirral, we have a Labour Councillor who's a member of the Mormon Church, Salt Lake City, Utah. As a condition of membership, a portion of salary (can't remember how much, but might be 10 per cent) has to be paid across to the church. I'm not sure that this drain on public money is declared to his electorate when he's out leafleting around this time, but I doubt it very much ! After all, who'd vote for that? I didn't think Councillors got a salary as such .... Just expenses or similar. Strange point I think!
Denise Lloyd Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 Wirral is quite correct about the % thing. Roger did you not have any FC's in police?
Roger Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 Wirral is quite correct about the % thing. Roger did you not have any FC's in police? I take it that was a typo and you meant Freemasons? Yup .... Obviously. .... Loads there! Not my bag I'm afraid ... I am not a member and never was. They do seriously good Charity work but I never liked the other elements around it!
Cambo Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 GET INVOLVED Join us in making a difference to young lives. With your support and involvement we can do more. Why not join one of our mission trips to Kampala, run in partnership with NewSpring Church in South Carolina, USA. You can find out more here. You can give to Heroes through the link below, or for more information email heroes@freedomchurch.cc. For those living outside of the UK, or to make a one-off donation, please give here. Make sure to tick the Make this recurring (monthly) box if that's what you would like to do. If you are a UK resident and would like to set up a monthly gift, please download the Standing Order form, and if you are a UK tax payer also complete the Gift Aid form. The Gift Aid form will result in the UK Government giving an additional 25p to Freedom Heroes for each £1 you give. GIVE
WirralPC Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 I didn't think Councillors got a salary as such .... Just expenses or similar. Strange point I think! Expenses / allowance then. 10 per cent of expenses / allowance.
Roger Posted April 21, 2015 Report Posted April 21, 2015 Expenses / allowance then. 10 per cent of expenses / allowance. That is their loss .... They seem to be donating their own money? Lawfully claimed ..... Still not sure about the point being made here .....
WirralPC Posted April 22, 2015 Report Posted April 22, 2015 I'll spell it out for you Roger if you'll bear with me Prospective councillor knocks on Roger's door, wanting his vote on May 7th. Roger, being a nice chap, patiently listens to the spiel right through to the end. The Mormon Church, including candidate's membership / existing financial arrangements are carefully omitted from the spiel. Roger votes for the councillor. Councillor is duly elected. Roger, not being a Mormon, feels cheated because the lovely councillor didn't mention that 10 per cent of his expenses / allowance was going overseas to prop up religious nuts. Roger thinks: "If only I'd asked a few questions, I could have exposed this nasty little truth. I could have voted for somebody else, who was not voluntarily handing recycled council tax money over to far flung whackoes AND who chances are is not chained to a hidden (for the purposes of getting elected) religious calling and may be more honest, open and transparent in his separate day-to-day dealings re: representation of my interests locally."
Roger Posted April 22, 2015 Report Posted April 22, 2015 If an elected Councillor wants to send abroad 10% of their lawfully claimed expenses then that isn't on my radar to be honest. What I do care about tho is the 0.7 % of GDP which the Govt. sends abroad as Foreign Aid. Is it something like £50 billion? I know it's coming to an end but I think it's bonkers sending aid to India when that Country funds a space programme instead of sorting out it's own poor and destitute. Just to clear up any doubt I'm basically pretty much non religious. Apart from attending Weddings/Christenings/Funerals ... I have no connection whatsoever with The Freedom Church.
WirralPC Posted April 22, 2015 Report Posted April 22, 2015 Not worth a response. But cheers. It was very enlightening regardless.
Edna Welthorpe (Mrs) Posted April 22, 2015 Report Posted April 22, 2015 I'll spell it out for you Roger if you'll bear with me Prospective councillor knocks on Roger's door, wanting his vote on May 7th. Roger, being a nice chap, patiently listens to the spiel right through to the end. The Mormon Church, including candidate's membership / existing financial arrangements are carefully omitted from the spiel. Roger votes for the councillor. Councillor is duly elected. Roger, not being a Mormon, feels cheated because the lovely councillor didn't mention that 10 per cent of his expenses / allowance was going overseas to prop up religious nuts.gives 10% Roger thinks: "If only I'd asked a few questions, I could have exposed this nasty little truth. I could have voted for somebody else, who was not voluntarily handing recycled council tax money over to far flung whackoes AND who chances are is not chained to a hidden (for the purposes of getting elected) religious calling and may be more honest, open and transparent in his separate day-to-day dealings re: representation of my interests locally." In what way has Roger been cheated? The councillor will be paid the same amount of expenses regardless of whether he gives 10% to the Mormons, puts 50% in the collection tray at church on a Sunday, or spends 100% of it on beer on a Friday night.
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