...and Here's How Our Urban Streets Should Look...

[Alex]

Thanks for responding Alex.

 

The symbolic expressions which you so eloquently described, were just that..... expressions.

 

They didn't hurt anybody, they didn't cause distress, and they didn't cost the taxpayer any money.

 

I'm all for progress, but surely as we only have one planet, we should at the very least try to look after it?? If it takes a little more time, a little more effort, or costs, in the short term, a little more money, don't we have a duty to try these options first?

 

Long term, not only will we benefit, but our children and grandchildren.

 

An an ideal world yes but we are far from an ideal world my friend. We need to put this into perspective sometimes and yes I really do like tree's and I would like to preserve them too where possible but this demonstrating was you have to admit way ott, well, that was my view. They will come down in the end, mark my words. We will have to agree to disagree, like you said no harm in having different views. 

[dippyhippy]

Perspectives are deeply personal, I feel Alex.

 

Our perspective, on something, can be as unique as each individual.

 

I can't agree that the tree demonstrations were OTT.....I actually found the wrapping of these trees in hand knitted scarves quite beautiful, poignant even.

 

I'm not one for prayers and candles, but if folk chose that way to express the sadness and futility they felt, then I would absolutely defend their right to do that.

 

One thing we are definitely in agreement on though, we most certainly do not live in an ideal world! Let's take a chance, when one is offered, to try and make it a little better, for everybody.

 

I hope you have a lovely bank holiday tomorrow.... and let's hope that the sun shines brightly on us all!

 

Take care.

[jeanharris]

greenknight,   firstly I would hate Hereford to become the new Cotswolds or any other kind of chocolate box pastiche full of pleated skirts, labradors and retired brigadiers who have nothing better to do than pursue boundary disputes.   Actually York , Oxford or even Cardiff were more what I had in mind but on a smaller scale, or again any Dutch city you can name.   

 

There's nothing mutually exclusive about reducing car dependence and having a thriving, mixed economy and socio economic profile.  My point was that   if you make your urban spaces unappealing, the only people who will stay around are those who have no choice and that is a recipe for poverty and decline as Newport illustrates on a daily basis.  High quality architecture and street design,  green civil spaces and transport choices benefit everyone and attract visitors as well - that surely is common sense.  

 

To answer your question directly : you seem almost to be saying that because you would find it infeasible to use alternatives to your vehicle, then it somehow isn't worth doing.  What I'm saying is that there will always be some journeys that most of us can make by other modes and that people should have a choice.  One thing is for sure:  if there is no alternative but to use a car, then people will use a car and the 30% who still don't have access  to one will continue to be disadvantaged.  

 

To make it less abstract,  I would like to see: 

 

1.  Every residential street turned into a Home Zone, with cyclist/pedestrian priority measures and speeds limited to 10mph with good street design;

2.  Every school with a Safe Routes to School scheme in place, identifying the principal routes the children take and re-engineering the streets to give them priority - this would encourage children to make the school independently and reduce the impact of the school run.  This has been immensely successful in Denmark and other places on the Continent;

3.  De -pedestrianisation of the city centre, opening it up to bikes and public transport with limited car access;

4.  De-regularisation of parking, to provide more on-street parking for specific purposes, perhaps with a meter scheme.  Cleverly configured parking bays actually make parked vehicles part of the traffic calming;  

5.  Network wide re-engineering of the roads, re-allocating road space away from motorised vehicles in favour of bikes and public transport to give these modes a time and convenience advantage. In particular I would like to see 50% of the road space in Edgar Street and Victoria Street re-allocated to cyclists and public transport.    In Holland you often see streets with two way access for bikes but one way for vehicles; at the moment it's impossible to travel east to west on a bike without having to venture onto the ring road or get off and walk;

6. Removal of street clutter and traffic lights and replacement of the Highways Agency's terrible pinch point schemes with Poynton style roundels to maximise traffic flow;

7.  Reduction of car park capacity overall (parking is the main determinant of whether people choose to use the car)  but an increase in parking provision for people with disabilities and those who need a permit for access to the city;

8. Park and ride at the main gateways to the city:  Ross Road, Ledbury Road, Holmer Road etc with a regular, cheap, efficient shuttle bus of light rapid transit vehicle;  

9. Much improved public transport including Colin's tram idea, possibly using hybrid vehicles that will run on road and rail;

10. Bike hire stops around the city, including electric bikes for those not fit enough to attempt the hills;

11.  Car clubs like the St James Car Club to liberate families from the need to buy and run second vehicles.

 

There's a huge amount that could be done very quickly and at much less cost than roadbuilding.  I appreciate that your cycling days might be over but we really do want to inculcate this habit in children instead of consigning them to a life of viewing the world through the rear window.  

 

If you travel out of Hereford frequently, you will be only too aware of how bleak and choked our road network is now, and that is after forty years of trying to tarmac our way out of the problem. It's a kind of madness.

 

[jeanharris]

You have some great ideas Amanda. Let's hope you get on the Council on Thursday. Good luck

[dippyhippy]

Cambo's suggestion of a congestion charge on this thread, seems to have caught on.

 

BBC Hereford and Worcester, have apparently made mention of this.... although I can't find it! 

 

Anybody else heard this???

[greenknight]

Not yet Dippy but I'm in favour particularly for traffic passing through or around the city on a new road. For those of us who find it necessary to travel using major road networks I think it will come...expensive but it makes you think.I use the severn crossing about four times a month on the return from the southwest and in commercial vehicle that's over £40 per month.

[megilleland]

I heard this congestion charge debate today on BBC Hereford & Worcester.

[dippyhippy]

Oh thanks, Megilleland!

 

I was beginning to think I'd dreamt it!

 

You know me, the line between dream and reality has always been a bit of a blur at the best of times! 

[Cambo]

I've had a little listen john Harrington is not in favour.

But I think this is a cultural issue & there's a need to change people's hearts & minds to get out of there cars? Hereford has a rubbish public transport system to be fair due to people not wanting to use it that's way the bus service has been reduced not enough decent cycle routes into the city?

 

I think people do need a number of different modes of public transport to choose from that's why a tram system is a great idea a good park & ride also as well as better cycle routes & a much improved bus service?

 

But it's getting those people out of there cars which is the key how do you do that?

 

Most people admittedly won't like a congestion charge but it might encouraging people to get out of there's cars? Also it's a option to building lots of new roads? The money raised could be reinvest in having a better public transport systems?

[Cambo]

I've had a little listen john Harrington is not in favour.

But I think this is a cultural issue & there's a need to change people's hearts & minds to get out of there cars? Hereford has a rubbish public transport system to be fair due to people not wanting to use it that's way the bus service has been reduced not enough decent cycle routes into the city?

 

I think people do need a number of different modes of public transport to choose from that's why a tram system is a great idea a good park & ride also as well as better cycle routes & a much improved bus service?

 

But it's getting those people out of there cars which is the key how do you do that so that they will start using public transport?

 

Most people admittedly won't like a congestion charge but it might encouraging people to get out of there's cars? Also it's a option to building lots of new roads? The money raised could be reinvest in having a better public transport systems?

 

Another option could be to make the bridges toll bridges?

[Amanda Martin]

Good stuff from John.   Actually, Cambo, I'm not in favour of congestion charges either.  Studies show (sorry, I know that's annoying but they do) that where there are no feasible alternatives, people will just dig deeper and carry on driving because they have to - it's an elastic market.  I think you have to put the alternatives in place first. 

 

You know what I don't understand?   There's a small fortune spent on consultants who "borrow your watch to tell you the time" and yet the guys who know how to do this stuff are just across the channel!  Why the hell don't we ask them?!!  

[Cambo]

Don't get me wrong Amanda I don't like congestion charges either.

But how do you encourage people to stop driving there cars?…because unless that happens there just going to keep building expensive new roads & to be honest if you speak to most people in herefordshire a large majority will say we need a bypass & at lest one river crossing.

[dippyhippy]

I think many of the answers lie within this very thread, Cambo.

 

Implement the small, relatively cheap changes first.

 

Improving cycle routes, bringing in safe routes to school and walking buses, etc.

 

Also an initiative like edge of the East of the city parking, for college students with a regular bus, perhaps partly funded by the colleges themselves and also student permits to use this park/ride facility???

 

Look seriously at The Tram Plan, with a feasibility study.

 

Once folks can see there are options, they may well prefer to leave the car at home, for at least some of their journeys.

 

Add in the possibility of a second, Eastern river crossing, and you start to have the potential to really make a mark on the congested roads across our city.

[Maggie May]

I think we sometimes forget how much cars cost to run until you stop using them regularly. Like many things it is a habit and like America many of us have got out of the habit of NOT driving when we don't need to. It is surprising how much money you can save by walking with your children and how much less hassle over parking. With no in car radio and having to keep your eyes open I always enjoy walking with my children and we have some great conversation, play games and do things that I wouldn't do if I was driving them and getting stressed over parking near the school. etc. Much better for all our health and alot less stressful getting out of the car even if just one or two days a week. I also have that bit of extra money I have saved on fuel which can go back into the local economy.

 

Can we start developing European transport habits as we have enough health problems from obesity following the American pattern.

[greenknight]

Now Maggie I know you ladies like to multi task but these days young mums are often pushing the buggie with one hand and using the phone with the other. There is conversation but not necessarily with mother and child.

[dippyhippy]

The Civic Society have put forward their vision for Hereford, both in terms of housing and transport. There's quite a good write up on HT, but my usual technical incompetence prohibits a handy link being added!

 

Interesting to note that they are talking shared space, an Eastern river crossing and electric trams!

 

Have they been reading this thread on Hereford Voice, I wonder......!

[greenknight]

Yes I thought that Dippy.

I was also intrigued about t h e suggested retirement village. Those people I know that live in the Rose Garden Centre do like it there.

[Denise Lloyd]

http://www.herefordtimes.com/news/13508599.A_new_town_and_light_rail_stops_in_many_villages___a_civic_group_s_vision_for_Herefordshire/?ref=mr&lp=10

 

 

http://www.herefordtimes.com/news/13508598.Care_complex_could_be_answer_to_Herefordshire_s_ageing_population/?ref=mr&lp=11

 

 

http://media.wix.com...e52b0a2230c.pdf

 

The middle link takes you to the Extra Care Home development proposal.  The applicant is Collins Development headed up by none other than Russell Pryce - ex HC Planning Officer

[dippyhippy]

A report on Hereford Civic Society's vision for Herefordshire, will be on BBC Midlands Today at 6.30pm.

 

Just heard the trailer for it!