Justice for the Ninety Six.

[bobby47]

At last! Since that dreadful day in 1989 the families of the dead, their friends and relatives and the people of Liverpool have fought them all in their pursuit of the truth and now, over a quarter of a century later, they've finally crossed the finishing line and won a great victory against all those who lied, secreted the facts and tried to place the blame at the feet of Liverpool supporters and the great people of Liverpool.

The political establishment, the Police, most notably the Sun newspaper, they all lied and secreted their wrongdoings to the detriment of all who grieved following the Hillsborough disaster and now it's all over. The Ninety Six were unlawfully killed! This is a victory, not only for the Ninety Six and all the people of Liverpool, but a victory for the power of people who refused to give in.

[dippyhippy]

I completely agree, Bobby.

 

This completely validates what the families have been saying for years, and vindicates those poor souls who so tragically lost their lives that day.

[Ubique]

Now hope that the Police Officers plus others who told lies and twisted the evidence all those years ago are brought to justice

[bobby47]

Within only a short period of time once the gravity of the disaster became realised and the enormity of the Policing errors became obvious to all, the Reputation Management began to be creative by claiming that the Leppings Lane End Gates were forced open by Liverpool supporters. To ensure the Liverpool supporters and the Liverpool people got the blame quickly tagged onto them by the wider watching world they deployed the media to report that Liverpool supporters urinated on the brave Police Officers who were trying to save lives. If that wasn't enough, they told terrible lies claiming that Liverpool supporters were picking the pockets and stealing from the dead and injured and pretty much everyone who was in the Leppngs Lane End was drunk.

Then, once they'd diverted attention away from themselves and their operational shortcomings that killed The Ninety Six, they quickly recruited the assistance of The Sun Newspaper who happily perpetuated these terrible untruths that insulted, hurt and demonised every single person associated with the great City of Liverpool.

Within a relatively short space of time the Reputation had been successfully managed and despite a quarter of a century of protest and endless investigative enquiries the Great Lie remained intact because the establishment required that the Reputation of the Police remained intact, unblemished and beyond any open and honest critique from the public.

This conclusion today, that the Ninety Six were unlawfully killed matters to every single one of us and everyone should reflect upon why it was possible to cause the deaths of Ninety Six people and for nobody to ever be held to account. It was made possible by the blight and curse of all our public services. Reputation Management! Whether it's the illegal actions of our former Prime Minister Tony Blair, the Mid Staffs NHS disgrace, Councils allowing Bullying and paying out Gagging Payments to silence the whistleblower or the death of the Ninety Six who went to watch a football match and never went home, it's the Management of the Reputation that becomes the most important issue to them. It's not you, me or anyone else who might perhaps have an issue with public service thats uppermost in their minds. It's them and their Reputation that matters and they'll pretty much do anything and say anything to protect themselves against any negative media reports.

It happened over a quarter of a Century ago and it's happened many times since and you can be sure it'll happen again. Reputation Management is the reason why public servants feel the need to lie. It's cultural. It's built into every single model of public service and nothing I've seen since Hillsborough suggests to me that this practice will end anytime soon.

[dippyhippy]

Bravo, Bobby.

 

An incredible post.

[H.Wilson]

Unlawful Killing was the only conclusion they could come to simply because people were at a football game minding their own business, yes the police should share the blame as should the council and football authorities for allowing such a high profile game to take place in such a delapidated stadium in the first place. I agree that everyone that had lied, changed evidence and tried to cover up the truth should be held accountable but there is one group that to this day refuses to be held accountable and that the Liverpool supporters themselves.

 

Obviously, not all of the Liverpool supporters at the game are to blame but you cannot ignore the fact that the actions of a minority also contributed to this disaster. They have and will never accept that along with the police the stewards and local authority they also should acknowledge and accept some of the blame. This is not a dig at all Liverpool supporters because as a football supporter who regularly attended matches at that time the behaviour of a minority of fans from all clubs was unacceptable and this disaster may also of happened had it been supporters of Leeds, Chelsea, Aston Villa etc

 

My sympathies have always gone to the victims families because nobody should go to a football game and loose their life.

[bobby47]

'H', I'm not trying to get you in a stranglehold here but why exactly do you think that the Liverpool supporters need to apologise. What do you think that they did that requires them to say sorry?

[dippyhippy]

Just announced....

 

South Yorkshire chief constable - David Crompton - suspended, with immediate effect, over handling of the Hillsborough Inquest.

 

Kelvin McKenzie - editor of The Sun at the time, says he was caught up in 'the smear' tactics, and has apologised. He has cited sources for his coverage of events as 'a senior police officer and a conservative MP'.

 

People lied. They deceived. They covered their own backs. This continued for twenty seven years.

 

The truth is finally out.

 

We'll no doubt hear an awful lot of apologies over the coming weeks.

 

One group who definitely do NOT need to apologise, are the supporters. I find it incredible that there are folks who still believe they would need to.

 

They were NOT to blame.

[K.Butt]

'H', I'm not trying to get you in a stranglehold here but why exactly do you think that the Liverpool supporters need to apologise. What do you think that they did that requires them to say sorry?

 

 

In fairness, I don't see anyone asking for an apology but H.Wilson has made some valid points. There was clearly a cover up here but I do not believe that all 100% of the fans were blameless and if you do, then obviously you never attended any of the big games at that time.

[bobby47]

'K', Because I once liked you I'm going to be gentle with you. Tell me you sniff glue. Say it's so and I'll quickly understand that inhaling a half litre of Evo Stick before you login to Hereford Voice can bring havoc and debility to a sniffers line of thinking.

You've just said that a percentage, an undisclosed number of Liverpool Supporters, are to some extent blameworthy for the Ninety Six killings in The Leppings Lane end of the ground. Do you understand and fully grasp that the Inquest Jury exonerated 'all' supporters and what's more, this near on twenty seven year fight was carried out to prove to you and others that the deaths and pain and suffering were not the result of the behaviour of any single Liverpool supporter?

Finally, and I do appreciate you were probably floating on the ceiling when you shared your thoughts with me, why do you think attending any football match way back when gives you some special insight into the credibility of anyone who didn't attend a football match way back then.

My tepid and lukewarm regards to you.

[Denise Lloyd]

The loss of life the pain and suffering of the relatives and friends just too terrible to even contemplate and congratulations to the people who have displayed enormous courage and conviction to at last get the justice they so justly deserve.

 

What I do have a serious problem with is how could these people in positions of authority carry this terrible burden for 27 years knowing that they have lied and been complicit in the cover up of the deaths of 96 innocent people.  The cover up team (I can't call them people) have led normal lives they've climbed the promotion ladder been congratulated on a good job had pay rises married had children and probably grandchildren enjoyed festive periods over the 27 years enjoyed family celebrations .  Nobody knew the dreadful sinful secret they carried with them.  If they are capable of this what other shocking secrets do they carry? This is just sheer evil. Anybody got an explanation.

[Pete.g]

Bobby

 

I applaud you sir , k and h I trust you consider how you can make more informed decisions than a jury who have given 2 years of their lives to bring the start of justice for the 96. I concur with Bobby that you must be on something to make such comments. The jury found that the Liverpool supporters were not to blame, end of.

 

I look forward to joining my fellow kopites at Swansea on Sunday when I am sure a song will be sung in memory of the 96.

 

Sorry , but hang your heads in shame. The jury has delivered , justice has been done.

 

YNWA

 

Pete

[Paul Jones]

H Wilson has raised points about how things were back then and I agree it was very different back then and I am speaking from my own experiences. I am over 6ft in height and I rarely was me feet on the terraces but I was regularly carried and swayed along in all directions with the crowd and when a goal was scored it was even more intense.

 

But when up to 20% of the jury disagrees with the overall decision it is not exactly a watertight verdict in my view, even after 2 years of considering the evidence 2 people still couldnt be convinced to go along with the majority.

[Steve Major]

I just read this on another forum, 'Pause For Thoughts'

 

Can you imagine the outcry if the jury had returned a verdict of accidental death or death by misadventure. I suspect that the Liverpool families would have demanded another inquest, but because they got the result they wanted they are singing outside the court !. I think to put most of the blame on one man is unjust, there were a number of factors which lead to this tragedy but it has to be said that the Police did themselves no favours by trying to cover up the truth. What I would like to know is if all the fans had got to the ground in plenty of time ie 30 mins before kick off, would this disaster still have happened, I'm not passing the blame onto any of the fans but has this question been addressed ?

 

[Cambo]

I think this verdict was a long time in come but finally justice has been served for the victims & their family's.

 

This was a catylist of errors which where made by the police along with other factors on the day which lead to the catastrophe loss of 96 lives…was a tragedy in itself but the fact that the police then went on to blame the Liverpool fans…then fabricate the evidence which lead to the demonisation of the Liverpool supporters by the government & press of the day was a disgrace!!!…in my opinion the police should of held their hands up,admitted their own failings on that day instead of allowing this great injustice to contuine for 27 years is almost unforgivable.

[the casual]

Well said Bobby. I'll never understand how police officers stood by and did nothing when they could clearly see people being crushed.

The FA should also face punishment as there were crushes in that stadium in the years leading up to 1989.

[dippyhippy]

To address some of the 'points' raised in some comments above :

 

* There were roadworks on the motorway between Sheffield and Liverpool. Liverpool fans arriving late should have been predicted, and allowed for. K.O could and should have been delayed. It wasn't.

 

* The pens were a death trap. If too many were allowed in from the back, there was no escape at the front. The consequences were then inevitable.

 

*  What were the police doing to marshal the supporters? The area outside the perimeter to The Lepping Lane is very narrow, and adjacent to the River Don. The crowd needed to be managed on approach, not once they got there, to avoid crushing. This was not done by the police.

 

* Liverpool fans got the smaller areas of the ground, despite having - as everyone knew - the bigger support. Changes had been made to these arrangements in previous semi finals, but not this time. Why not?

 

* The two middle sections can be shown in film footage to be overly full, even before the order to open the perimeter gate was given. Had the central tunnel under the stand - which led directly to the middle pens - been closed off, this would have diverted late comers to the pens either side. Another failure.

 

* The FA had selected to host a cup semi final, in a death trap. There was no safety certificate. They could have opted for Villa Park, in Birmingham. Legislation certainly did not prevent this.

 

* The police failed to manage. Sheffield Wednesday failed to ensure fan safety. The FA failed to use a ground that had a valid safety certificate.

 

The author of the above points - Alisdair Galloway -  adds 'Your source should be ashamed of ever writing that, as should you be for repeating it.'

 

Shameful. I agree.

[Steve Major]

This is a terrible situation which was undoubtibly and discustingly has been covered up! I do not buy into that one person is to blame for the fatal events that followed, it was a catalogue of errors.

 

I am not a fan of majority verdicts and you cannot get away from what Paul Jones has written above; 

 

But when up to 20% of the jury disagrees with the overall decision it is not exactly a watertight verdict in my view, even after 2 years of considering the evidence 2 people still couldnt be convinced to go along with the majority.

 

However, I do feel that I am probably wasting my time with some members on here in expressing my opinion because those people will never admit a single fan was anything other than an angel that day.

 

I do hope that the families of the victims now have some sort of closure in what has clearly been a long ordeal for them all. 

[dippyhippy]

And I'm probably wasting my time trying to stop some members from spouting shameful rubbish.

 

Let's not let little things like truth and justice get in the way of sharing ignorant opinion.

[bobby47]

Dippy, My dearest friend and protege, how many times must I tell you not to do this. No good comes of it. Whether it's the Ninety Six dead, their grieving families or the plight of the Medditeranean migrants and the little children who've been brought to the West for a stab at a better life, you'll get no comfort or agreement upon here.

The truth is there are two camps. One that I lead that has one follower and it's you and the other that Steve, Paul, and many others who've tired of us belong to. In short my good and dearest friend we are done. Buggered to be exact. If I announced to the reading world of Hereford Voice that I'd discovered a cure for The Syphilis, the others who don't like you and I would defend the joy and the wonderful benefits the bacteria bring and they'd argue that I'd do well to destroy whatever it was that I'd stumbled upon that prevents your private parts and other extremities from dropping off as your sat on the toilet emptying your bowels.

Take care pal!

[dippyhippy]

And you, my friend.

 

The air has become increasingly toxic. Perhaps it is time I heeded your wise words.

[bobby47]

Well done pal. And don't think for a single moment that 'they' might be the problem. It could easily be us. We could quite easily be the fly in the ointment. It bloody isn't mind. It's 'them' and anyone who says otherwise takes an opposite view to me.

Now take care. Stop the bickering and the pointless exchanges that only fuel the rift that's blighted the HV and do and write things that are more productive.

See you mate.

[ragwert]

In fairness, I don't see anyone asking for an apology but H.Wilson has made some valid points. There was clearly a cover up here but I do not believe that all 100% of the fans were blameless and if you do, then obviously you never attended any of the big games at that time.

Watch the cctv videos.You will find not one Liverpool supporter had anything to do with this tragedy.

8ft high fences between the stands & pitch. stands which were full to capacity & someone gave the order to open the gates.

[ragwert]

Makes you think